current time 1710Z WSSS doing a poor job, I undertand it’s a busy day but come on almost 1h being 2 in line for departure is crazy, and also approach should give better separation so tower can have time to line up acft for departure, we’re pretty much spotting acft. one pilot was given instruction to line up very late with another acft on final, pilot did a good job going around but the acft instructed to line up and wait was reported, it takes a few seconds to get moving, we shouldn’t be entering the rwy at 20kts
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You can send the ATCer a message about an undesirable experience. They’re trying their hardest in the large volumes of inbounds 
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I know they are that’s why I don’t send a message directly to them, it may distract them or discourage and we don’t want that, this post it’s the best I can do to reach out to them, and maybe let them know about our experience and what could’ve been done, and today ATC was very late giving “LINE UPS” instructions and also I understand he had very short separation from arrival to do so…
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It’s typically better to send them a message, as it doesn’t “expose” them publicly. They likely will not be on the IFC while controlling.
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Just curious, how would you know if that guy who lined up got reported or if he just left? Generally ATC would not report for slow lineups unless there is some other issue.
Also, I understand the frustration but just so you know, around 1700Z there were 100 aircrafts in an hour which is almost impossible to control if not hold the deps a bit. The aircrafts in AIR will always get preference over GROUND. You can hold on ground but the ones in air would not be able to beyond their fuel limit.
I would say just enjoy the experience, it is what Expert Server is for.
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you may be right, he may’ve left, I said it bc after almost an hour waiting and when he finally got cleared to line up, he took a bit longer and them just disappeared and I just assumed he was reported…
I’m very aware that acft in the air got preference over GND, and maybe mentioning TWR wasn’t fair because I understand he didn’t have enough space/separation to line acft up, I think that is something approach controllers should be more aware of too, like trying to give bigger separations to allow acft on the ground to leave.
but as you said, it’s part of the experience so it’s all good!!
Well if there isn’t enough time between the arrivals to send deps out, what is the ATC supposed to do?
wait that wave of aircraft to land and once it gets less crowded radar will add extra spacing between each arriving traffic to make departures possible for tower between them
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ATC are volunteers so don’t be harsh on them they’re trying their best.))
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Interesting discussion — I was departing WSSS during that busy period as well.
I actually received a Level 2 violation for taxiing through another aircraft (Fiji 424QR). I appealed it, but after seeing the evidence I completely understand and accept the decision — I simply didn’t see the aircraft at the time.
What I found interesting from a learning perspective is that, as far as I can remember, I had only received “Taxi to Runway 20C” and didn’t receive a “Give Way” or “Hold Position” instruction regarding the Fiji aircraft. Of course, I understand that situational awareness remains the pilot’s responsibility regardless of ATC instructions.
Given how exceptionally busy WSSS was, I was curious whether anyone else experienced something similar that evening — either a ground conflict or not receiving a give-way instruction?
Definitely a good learning experience for me, and huge respect to the controllers managing that amount of traffic!
C
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As the approach controller for 20R, I’m unable to take any further action at that time. I’m managing more than 15 aircraft and at the same time the traffic is still increasing. Even though our final is getting longer and longer. The tower is doing his best.
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I totally understand, I was once a controller myself and I know how easy it can get out of hand when it’s that busy so no stress, I think my only frustration with tower came with the fact that he missed so many opportunity to line acft up after some landings at 20C with visible space/separation, for instance I was number two for departure and it took 1h30 to leave, but also controlling two busy runway with that amount of acft inbound is definitely not easy to keep up with (it could’ve been easier if we had two TWR for each runway) so I totally understood why he wouldn’t give us clearance.
The main goal of this post is really to hear other people’s opinions and perspectives and see how we can improve next time, that’s why I try not to criticize or attack any specific controller, especially since I know how hard it is to manage such busy airspace.
But ultimately, what matters is the experience and the fact that everything turned out well.
Thanks for your service!
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