Training Server Ghosting System

It’s still on Expert, and…it’s useless. No one actually checks the tutorials.

Because everyone always thinks the controller made a mistake in sending it to them.

Again, my point: everyone thinks they’re doing it right, otherwise they wouldn’t be doing it.

There are a few trolls, but mostly it’s just plain ignorance of what is proper (ignorance in its dictionary form: “lack of knowledge”)

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I wish you guys got to see some of the justifications we get after ghostings and how many times pilots absolutely refuse to believe they did anything wrong when the replay shows…well, you know.

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I think the best thing to add here is an "On Runway" violation :
For any case of presence of plane on the runway and you still land on it against that, you will get a message like ( you’ve landed on a taken runway in Red) a violation + penalities.

I suggest also to add a "limit time" message on runways .

that means if a pilot take too much time to clear it (in case of the takeoff) : for example, if you’re ready for takeoff and you are still on the runway for (a maximum of 2 minutes motionless) you will get a message like :
"CLEAR THE RUNWAY NOW" in Orange , + penalities at the end of the flight… (but no violation in this case)

could be nice in the Training AND Expert servers

It might not be currently active, but a runway idle notice and violation already exists.

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Yeah, there are many topics asking for Training Server improvement.

Which will all come to naught because there is one thing, and one thing only, that will make people “behave.”

And it isn’t tutorials or IFC accounts or anything else.

Even on Expert, there are plenty of pilots that do the right thing only when they think someone is watching. And missing an event seems to be high among the list of reasons why it was okay for them to takeoff from the ramp or takeoff through the guy who just landed. “I shouldn’t have done that on principle” never seems to come out in appeals.

If only reports will change behavior, which is simply hard fact, and IF has made it clear in no uncertain terms that that is something that won’t happen any time in the imminent future, TS is just going to be what it is.


But, while we’re here talking about how the training server is this or that, or how awful it is to have to interact with some of the behavior, can we also take some time to note that the behavior doesn’t end on TS alone. Much of the things here have begun to creep their way onto Expert. And, many people who probably think they’d make just the perfect moderator of the training server are probably also some of the ones who’ve brought the I-can-do-what-I-want-until-the-fourth-warning mentality to Expert.

Much of this stuff isn’t lack of knowledge or honest mistake-type stuff. It’s purely “I get a free bag of warnings each time I spawn anew, and heck if I’m not gonna use them.”


I’m much less concerned about the training server than trends I see on Expert. Honestly, it takes about a day and a half, if that, to get the points to go to Expert if you want. Spending all this time worrying about a server you can vacate rather expeditiously seems incredibly moot. The bigger issue is why these behaviors that everyone seems so desperate to escape are making their way forward.

If so many people are concerned about training, why am I watching 388s take off from 1500 foot dirt strips every session on Expert? Why do I have to actually tell you more than once you can’t push back through that plane behind you? Why are you just vectoring yourself until you get told for the third time to stop and think “okay now I guess I’ve used up my allotment of warnings, I’ll do it right?” Why do people with millions of XP tell me they hav Informaon Juliet then repeatedly request taxi to the end of the runway not in use? Why do I really hav to tell people if you are inside another person, but there’s 500 other parking spots, I don’t care who was first, one of you can be the bigger person and spawn elsewhere because you’re not moving through each other. I don’t care which, someone can be a bigger person. Why does everyone know duplicates are frowned upon but still repeatedly send them?

I could o on for days.

We spend thread after thread after thread taking about a server that you can get away from in no time at all, but we seem to just be bringing all those behaviors forward.

Statistically speaking, this behavior has to be coming from at least a subset of the same people discussing all the reasons they don’t like the “trolls” on training or how every flight is ruined. I haven’t bothered I look through the names, so I’m not thinking of anyone in particular, but I’m sure at leassome of you have done some of the things I mentioned above or worse on Expert, otherwise I wouldn’t have to continually check to make sure I wasn’t on the wrong server during a controlling session.

That concerns me a whole lot more that repeatedly rehashing the same ideas for TS. TS is gonna be like this for the foreseeable future. I’d much prefer that as much energy as is being devoted to pointing the finger there be expended in each individual asking themselves if they aren’t at least partially responsible for carrying those things forward. Even when they think no one is watching.

Because for all this pretention to everyone here being the perfect pilot, statistics suggest that simply isn’t so.

If it were, my report appeals wouldn’t include:

“But I do it all the time and other controllers let me.”
“I didn’t think anyone was around.”
“You weren’t actually controlling this dirt-strip field so what do you care if I take off in my 388 from it?”
“Yeah, I was at 1300 knots 6000 feet off the ground but I was still 1 nm away from the blue rings.”
“Usually when I taxi I just wait for the controller to tell me to wait for clearance so I wasn’t expecting that I’d actually be called out on it this time.”
“Yeah, maybe I did that, but tomorrow is FNF and I really wanted to fly there.”


Finger pointing is all well and good, but why expend so much energy on TS? You only have to be there for about a day if you out even a little time in.

Why not individually take that energy and direct it instead toward maintaining some semblance of personal responsibility on the Expert server, where that quality has become scarcer and scarcer every day?

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Change 3000 to 600

600 operations is very easy to accrue. A trained monkey could gain 600 in a week if it tried.

If this were ever to be implemented, the required amount of ops would need to be very high.

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TSATC are very underrated. If they couldn’t report anyone, they can at least say please follow instructions like come on. And I think that TSATC should be able to report but the report will be a lot less serious. Like they should just wait one day before going on the training server again and they can’t get more than 50 ghosts in one year. This is how it should be! There will be a lot less ghosts in the expert server and everyone will be more professional. And they should call training server ghosts “mini ghosts” or something like that. This will make everyone learn a lot easier on the training server.

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When you say mini ghosts, I put up a feature request for on screen warnings, exactly like before a system report, which doesn’t prosecute, but is a sure way to know that the pilots read your instruction. This server is purely for training, but can be a real pain as TSATC that you can’t report them. Maybe they should give a (TSATC trained only) ghosting for that flight, with no warning to the user, only just invisible in the ATC’s and other pilots eyes until they are out of the airspace, and from the pilots view the ATC becomes offline.

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Yea something like that.

Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes please

The training server doesn’t have to be animals roaming around the airport like monkeys

No offense to grade 2 people 🙂

I have had a feature request for these reasons.

Maybe trying ghosting at few airports in the beginning could be better.

There’s a reason it’s training server. To learn not be punished or forced into learning. Thats expert
You shouldn’t be punished for not knowing. Expert Server you are punished. And punished is a vage term that should be taken lightly, as you’re ghosted for a week so you can learn what you did wrong. But like stated by @Tim_B lots of people would rather blame the controller then themselves. And be ignorant and never learn.

Mine was transparent ghosting, it is about a few minutes and hours and its will be in a few airports. Solutions are easy and mine solution wasn’t a hard punishment.

It doesn’t have to be ghosting, just kick out the ones who don’t want to listen to ATC🤷🏻‍♂️

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I think it should come if this.
TS ATC reports user.
Report gets reviewed.
Determine if points get de deducted

Just imagine though how many reports would come in from EGLL and KLAX. Not to mention, training server is a place for people to train and to learn how to not get violations.

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