Minimums... TO/GA!

Good evening everyone!

I spent a while this evening, sat on the ground at KSAN - planning my flight to KLAX on my newly built spreadsheet model.

As you can see, I have a database of altitudes and heading instructions for if a go around is required, in the red box. I didn’t think I’d need this, but I had it just in case.

Estimated flight time, 25 mins. Light winds. Good flying conditions.

I pushback, taxi and takeoff.

I decided I’d follow the ILS approach to 25R, as other traffic was using it. I downloaded the ILS chart and used the waypoints and altitudes to make sure that I approached correctly.

I was at 10,000ft (as on the chart), but I had a controller desperate to get me to the lowest altitude possible. Not a problem, I knew that they were obviously inexperienced, and I did my best to comply.

I established on the localiser and was on final.

I got to minimums and had no clearance. Go around.

Contacted SoCal Departure and then SoCal Approach and they were both very helpful.

Back on final, but the tower controller signed off and some traffic decided to enter the runway. Go around again.

Contacted approach, and got lined up again. A new tower controller came online.

On final for the third time and I didn’t get clearance by minimums. Go around for a third time.

Approach didn’t really want to deal with me now, so I stayed on the KLAX Tower frequency and did a circuit of sorts.

4th approach. Fingers crossed. Minimums… no clearance - go around.

5th approach. Arriving traffic approached me from behind, and continued their final approach. No tower intervention. Go around.

6th approach. Thought I’d request 25L instead as it looked less busy, and I was cleared to land!

There’s my track. Wow. 😂

Let me know if you saw me during my 45 mins of go arounds!

First Officer Tom (flying American 803)


You deserve a medal! 😁 If only all people would create space between them and other pilots, prohibit collisions or just follow instructions…


The minimums call is for visual reference with the runway / runway lighting and has nothing to do with landing clearance obtained or not ;)


Ah, thanks Alex! 😎👍🏻

Sounds like you cought a bad controller, landings on 25R means traffic congestion on the taxiways for the outbound flights.
Usually all aircrafts land on 24R and 25L.

To all Tower controllers on the Playground: you can easily see if an aircraft is cleared for landing or not by looking at the color of its data. If it’s green it has been cleared, if it’s white give it the correct instructions before it’s too late.


Yep. A bad controller… or three! 😂

^Quote of the day? 👍🏻


Oh! Sorry. So at what point does a pilot decide if they need to go around? :)

Anytime during the approach the pilots can decide to go around whenever they feel its unsafe or for any other reason. Flying into an airport like London Heathrow they will tell you “expect late landing clearance” so you are ready for this. This would be a nice option in IF :)


Thanks! Was it correct to go around, because of the lack of landing clearance, at a height like 200 AGL? :)

This is why I always use the 24’s at LAX because hardly anyone ever uses them, when there’s 10 planes on the ground waiting for 25R there’s maybe one or two at 24L, and on the playground less landing traffic means less noobs to potentially ruin your approach/landing ;)


@htchngs what you described is exactly what happens every time if you want to fly by realistic rules etc, and avoid runway incursions etc, as I do. 99% of people just fly around with no regard and no idea. Unfortunately, I can’t handle having to ‘go around’ 16 times every flight as that’s obviously so unrealistic it’s just a sick joke. Advanced coverage is way way too thin so it’s no help.

For me, there’s definitely no Live subscription renewal happening when mine runs out.


Way, way, way, way, way… etc. too thin. 😂


I might try 24R next time, if weather and ATC permits :)

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Yes why everyone want to land on runway 25R or 25L and if I am tower and I say they most land on 24R or 24L.then they want lisstening to me. I want to be an advance controller then they lisstening to me

me too i dont like landing without a clearance. i have made 2-3 go arounds in a flying because that.

I love made a circling when airport is too busy to receive incoming planes, at KNUC sometime.

Actually I was completely wrong with my “minimums is only for visual reference”. Just had a discussion and its also for landing clearance, What minimums did you use if I can ask? Normal Cat I is 200 feet AGL.

There are terminals on both the North and South side of the airport.

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A Classic Post & learning vehical. Now if everyone would take the time and effort to provide well fleshed out examples of an unpleasant experience we would all benefit. Professionally done and responded to by all concerned.
Well done “Community”… GungHo (work together). Mad Max Sends


Yeah, I was using 200 feet AGL as minimums.

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This is why you should go to the Caribean region
1: because it’s less busy
2: I control there sometimes😄