I think many would agree. 1500PM UK time, london controller decided to drop absolutely everybody on the expert service into limbo.
Later this was then followed by Manchester approach.
Multiple diversions and what not, the airspace was a total ****show. No organisation or logic at all. Multiples of us in the hold for 30 plus minutes.
I diverted to Cardiff for fuel and tried to make a return and denied, diverted again into Liverpool.
Really disappointed.
Hey Daniel, I hope you’re doing good.
I don’t know if I’m the right person to answer your frustration.
But let me tell you something, ATC are volunteers, and they have to deal with unrealistic traffic when an airport is featured and it’s even worse since it’s an event.
Just keep in mind that they are doing their best to serve us all so we can have a bit of fun flying in a controlled/crowded airspace.
It’s better for you to fly to other secondary featured airport at least if you want some atc.
I repeat but ATC are doing their best, and it would never be perfect for sure, mistakes always happen, but remember if we don’t have them, expert server would be like the casual server in term of professionalism.
Just look at this picture and how hard their trying to vector everyone the fastest way possible. Have a nice day and see you in the sky.
LaTrixtance.
Yeah was pretty nuts. Can’t blame the ATCs for most of it though tbh, it should be expected with that level of traffic. It was complete chaos during the controller change, and I was genuinely super impressed how well Tower/Center/Approach organised everything so quickly once they came on. I agree it was a nightmare though, ended up turning my flight from Heraklion to Manchester into a 5 hour journey 
. But yeah, can’t blame the ATCs really. Still, made for this wacky ass looking approach.
It isn’t ATCs fault. Whenever there are events at major airports with single or only 2 runways (LHR, MAN, DXB, SAN) for example), there will be delays. It’s frustrating but hey, pilots all over the world want to join in the fun, which causes holding patterns and long taxi times.
Yesterday I waited for 50 mins taxing at ZRH. I was pissed. But there’s nothing ATC can do when everyone on the sim decides to fly in/out of the same airport. These controllers are doing any amazing job. As pilots, all we’re doing is just following their instructions. I’m pretty sure busy airports are much more annoying for them than they are for us.
This is when holding patterns at specific waypoints need to be implemented. Anything coming from south towards Manchester would hold at DAYNE , anything from west towards MAN would be at MIRSI , anything from east/north to MAN would hold at ROSUN. I do think it would make the ATC life more easier and realistic . Otherwise it all just becomes a snake path , with random holding points
Hello, I am an IFATC controller.
I know your frustration when ATC suddenly goes offline.
Bear in mind, ATC are volunteers; they are there to provide high-quality service.
When no other ATC are found to replace those people, and when not enough people are in the session, they will suddenly close. We don’t want to be overworked and deliver bad service.
And some have personal life reasons as well.
When approach goes offline, Tower goes too. With that unrealistic amount of traffic, it would be impossible to continue controlling.
And not advisable.
Maybe time to introduce slot/clearance for departure/arrival. cough cough…
you cant expect them to satify everyone mate theyre busy with so much traffic the work load leaves no space for extra.
sorry for what happened to you but they have no wrong in this no need to hate on IFATCs when they done such a wonderful job with that sequence all the way from center
Hi all,
I appreciate your input and certainly get the stance.
The delays are the delays, as with any event and I really enjoy the barrage of instructions.
Between me and 3 helveticas, starlux & emirates we held a fairly uniform hold over EGNX, I was then passed onto MAN APP, directed South westerly and the frequency got ditched. No warning no handover. Usually there is a few minutes gap but there was just a dead zone.
What’s more, inbound were being accepted on my return but I got advised to divert and then warned 
What?..
I will say this, whomever did take over certainly tidied up the zone and well done to them.
If only the requirements for Grade 3 were higher and pilots were required to follow specific procedures to avoid chaos. it is a joke for a Grade 3 pilot to request a diversion to MMMX while in the London FIR.
Not a mate.
It certainly isnt hate. A chanel of frustration on what is usually a very good service with bsck up controllers waiting in the wings.
That I absolutely agree with. The amount of times multiple users requested the same STAR procedure 5 or 6 times in a 10 minute gap. Unnecessary adding to the controllers work load.
it is hard to come with a team on this. mind you its not just one person doing all this. its a whole team and its not easy to gather it. if no one takes the frequency it is because theres simply not willing atcs who want to go in without a team & plan
Wasn’t flying to Manchester but I flew out a couple of hours ago around 2-3pm when it was getting busy but I think the expert server just having “100 landings” and a few experience points to get in is not enough. I think people should have to take a written test to get into expert server because I agree the traffic around Manchester looks ridiculous with many people having to divert.
Perhaps a super pro server (Career server).. grade 4 perks but with strong requirement.
My experience today, ATC assigned me a holding pattern near Manchester for the approach, while my destination was EGLL.
It isn’t the controller’s fault, users approaching Manchester don’t follow the STARs, which turns the traffic flow into chaos. If the STARs were followed correctly, it would be easier for the controller. the errors the controller made were due to the disorder in the airspace.
Why don’t they put some planes in hold north of MAN? Thats what they do in real life for some.
I think there is an important perspective that pilots need to understand.
I say this as someone who is part of the ATC organization: the perspective of a pilot and the perspective of a controller are simply not the same.
As a pilot, your responsibility is primarily to fly your aircraft, maintain awareness of your situation, listen to ATC and follow the instructions you are given. You are responsible for your aircraft and your flight.
As ATC, we are looking at the entire picture.
We are not looking at one aircraft. We are looking at dozens of aircraft simultaneously, their positions, altitudes, headings, routes, conflicts, sequencing, departures, arrivals, handoffs, frequency changes, diversions and everything else developing around them.
And during an event, the volume can become enormous.
We don’t just sit there and give instructions. We use every tool available to us, divide responsibilities between positions, coordinate with each other and constantly adapt the plan as traffic changes. Sometimes, despite all of that, the volume simply becomes too much for the situation to remain perfect.
A pilot may think: “Why am I being held for 30 minutes?”
The controller is thinking: “How do I safely fit this aircraft into a sequence while maintaining separation with everything else on my screen?”
Those are two completely different perspectives.
Pilots are not expected to determine whether two aircraft will conflict, build an arrival sequence for an entire airport, coordinate multiple sectors or decide how to restructure the airspace when traffic suddenly doubles. That is precisely why ATC exists.
So yes, if the service was inefficient, pilots are absolutely entitled to say so. We should always learn from mistakes and improve.
But criticism should come with an understanding of what is actually happening on the other side of the frequency.
You see your aircraft.
ATC sees the airspace.
And when an event produces an exceptional volume of traffic, keeping that entire picture under control is far more complex than it looks from a cockpit.
We are not asking pilots to blindly defend ATC. We are simply asking them to understand that the person giving you one instruction may simultaneously be managing dozens of other decisions that you will never hear or see.
There is a reason ATC exists — because managing the whole picture is a completely different responsibility from simply flying through it.
And one last thing: we are volunteers.
We give our own time to manage this traffic because we genuinely want the community to have a good ATC experience. We use every tool available, divide the workload and coordinate as much as possible, but there is a limit to what can realistically be handled when an event generates this amount of traffic.
From the cockpit, you experience your own flight. From the ATC screen, we see the entire picture.
I think that difference in perspective is something worth understanding before judging the people behind the frequency.
Regards
Josue3
Wow, was AI used here? 
Nice work and highly detailed. Explanation.
Hey, hello HAHAHA, I didn’t use AI, but if I took the time to write all this and it took me like 40-45 minutes 
, I don’t think using AI for this would describe it as well as I would in my own words 
