I departed KLAX for a 16 hour flight to OEJN and tower told me to contact departure so I did, and after I did the departure immediately told me to then contact KLAX center so I did. While I am contacting KLAX center I am flying the ORCKA5 departure, so when I contact center I am already making my left hand turn to the south and the center tells me to turn right to heading 180, but I’m already half way through my turn so I say I am sorry but I continue my turn so I can get on my departure and he says if I don’t comply I will be reported so I decided to end my flight as it wasn’t worth a violation. I would just like an explanation and want to know what I did wrong so I can fix it and don’t have to end another flight.
Hey there! I know you’re expecting the usual response, and that is exactly what I’m about to provide. I would recommend reaching out the controller who gave you the commands. There is usually a reason, and controllers are always welcoming to sort things out. If we are wrong, we admit it and learn from it. By the looks of it, @NightHawk is currently Center over the LA area. Feel free to reach out the them, or contact @appeals and explain the situation. Either way should give you the explanation you would like to receive.
Sounds like the controller might have been vectoring you out of the area on your departure. At that point, just comply (if the situation is safe to comply), and as long as you are cooperating with ATC commands, that violation would be an easy appeal and reversal.
ATC trumps a SID. Follow the instructions as you weren’t cleared for a specific departure
Thank you for the quick response, I will be sure to send them a pm.
That’s the rules. The controller would be trying to avoid other traffic as opposed to fly your exact route
Now that I’m looking at the ORKA departure path, that takes you directly over the airfield and final path for 24s and 25s for KLAX. I’m sure your turn would’ve put you in the path of planes on final and the tower saw something that you didn’t. At that point he was probably sending you crosswind until you got to 10,000 to make the turn you originally wanted. If you would’ve kept on, that is an easy violation to give.
Expert server correct? If anything just go fly out of LAS/PHX/SFO/SAN, on another note why would you take ORKCA5? it most likely would have made your flight more cumbersome if you needed it to be 16 hours, heading northeast probably would have made things easier here, if you do want to still take ORKCA5 just fill up with extra extra fuel and follow ATC’s orders if they aren’t delaying you too much. I definitley would have turned northbound considering that los angeles is probably extremely busy.
Yes this, I knew I wasn’t crazy.
I was using the IRL flight plan that Saudia uses from Simbrief.
I wasn’t worried about being delayed. I brought 2 extra hours of fuel, I just wanted to know what I was doing wrong because I thought I would be at a high enough altitude to cross the runways safely
You didn’t climb fast enough to stay out of the arrival’s paths, so you should respawn into LAX and bring 4-5 extra hours of fuel with you and floor it up to FL100 or 7000’ by the time you are nearing the planes that are landing, so just climb a lot faster than you did before, and by the way what was your v/s when this happened?
Hello, I was the center controller for Los Angeles & Oakland. Please allow me to explain my point of view so you can understand what I was thinking. I am responsible for a large amount of airspace that expands to 5 major international airports, and multiple other small, popular airports. At the time this conflict took place, I was managing 6 simultaneous approaches into various airports across the California/Nevada region. It was a very busy session. The reason you were vectored was because you were climbing into two arrivals descending to 6,000 at a very high rate of speed. I had instructed you to turn right heading 160 and to climb to an altitude that wouldn’t bust with aircraft. You acknowledged my instruction, and still continued to turn. You continued for about 20 seconds. I then asked you to follow instructions, and re-issued my command, which you also acknowledged. Another 10 seconds passed and you were within 4nm of busting into that traffic–I also put the traffic in a right-turn but you were going so fast it didn’t matter. I then gave you a please follow instructions or be reported, at which point you disconnected from the server.
Regardless of the departure SID you are flying, it is imperative to always follow ATC instructions. It’s always for a reason. Having to vector you off your path puts more work on my plate, which I already have a lot of. If I could, I would’ve let you stay on your FPL. I want you to provide you with the most efficient service possible, while also maintaining safe separation with all the other aircraft. While managing multiple approaches all over the California + Nevada region at the same time, I have to anticipate and see conflicts coming in the future. In short, I have to look 10 steps ahead of where you’re looking and plan for that. It’s very stressful trying to resolve a situation when the pilot does not follow your instructions because then I am forced to move multiple aircraft and/or report you if it doesn’t work. I do not like reporting pilots, and I only do it as a last resort, but I would have had no choice at that point. I knew your SID took you into a conflict, which is why I immediately vectored you–and if you had followed my vector, there would have been time to separate you from the arrival.
I hope you understand where I came from. My only goal is to get everyone in and out safely.
Please message me if you have any questions.
Should be closer to 4000 this time, and avoid the circled area.
As ATC said you were on course to hit people who were on approach into LAX, i’m sure if you fly north then turn east after a while no problems would insue 😁
Thank you for the quick and well made explanation. I believe I know what arrivals you are talking about which I also saw. I thought they would be at a safe enough distance that they wouldn’t be in the way but I became preoccupied with changing frequencies and must not have noticed them getting so close. Sorry for causing problems and again thank you for the great response. @NightHawk
I did the same route with FEDX VA 2 days Ago and I used simbrief for my route and I had no problems with ATC and it was really busy that day to were I waited at 7R for 5 min waiting for the good fro take off
That controller probably trusted the pilot more than the one did here.
so your saying its a pilot trust level thing because I don’t think my friend @BurritoLeo did wrong he did the same thing I did but I got nothing just a bye from the Controller
This is getting off topic. I believe the topic question has been sufficiently answered.