I’ve just finished a 1 hour and 30mins radar session at SBGR. I know many people are flying there, just take a look at the arrivals (197).
This post shouldn’t take too long to read, however, I’d like to address some things that can help you as pilots improve.
Patience, A controller will respond to you as quickly as possible and will get rid of you as quickly as possible. You don’t need to request a frequency change unless you KNOW the controller has forgotten. I’ve had so many pilots request a frequency change on an ILS approach and they’re not even established… So please, a little patience.
With that being said, if you request an approach and the controller hasn’t got back to you, fly your FPL till you’re given instructions. They will get to you as soon as possible. We give everyone instructions at the same time.
Tuning in to a certain frequency
If you’re inbound, and approach is opened you need to meet both of these requirements.
18000 aal (or less) and 50NM (or less) from the aerodrome. If you’re 34,000ft and 10NM then please, don’t tune in.
If you’re at 10,000ft and 80Nm, please don’t tune in.
You need to meet both altitude and distance.
Additionally, if you’ve just taken off and given a freq change please do not tune into approach. If you get told to contact approach, then you can.
I’m pretty reasonable, don’t go more than 350kts.
I give you speed commands and vectors away so you can slow down if you’re a little over. But when Jets tune going 1000+ kts then that’s when violations will be flying just as fast towards you.
I’m sure there is more to cover, but self-directed learning is appreciated.
Good day all
Great topic mate, hope we can see more of what was said from pilots. The part about patience is especially true. I was controlling at WMKK the other day, and when approach closed it was mayhem. Had around 10 aircraft calling inbound at once. Patience is a virtue, everyone. We are human too!
Very good topic and more people should read! I struggle with the same deal sometimes on tower. Ground is not so bad, but you have so many people calling in on tower and duplicate messages it makes it very stressful and hard for us controllers.
If any other controllers have anything to say feel free to post here
Also, sending your message twice when we haven’t responded in 10 seconds will not speed up our response. Many controllers work from the lowest and hence oldest flashing flight strip and work their way up. If a pilot sends a message again, they go to the top of the list and hence the end of the queue.
^^ that is very very true
To add on,
If you’re given an continue as filed (ILS, GPS, VIS) and then later on receive vectors, that means you do not follow FPL, follow the instructions given :)
Also asking for RVs to a certain runway, and when i assign another due to traffic, saying unable and proceeding at your own discretion. TS is a wonderfull place :)
Thanks for the reminder. I fly into many of the hubs myself, and I notice the shear amount of people that really should take note of this post.
Let’s not forget these two:
The pilot who contacts approach and simply checks in forcing the controller to ask for their approach request, which then requires the controller to respond to the approach request. Two commands instead of one really add up in a busy airspace. Don’t check in, just ask for the approach service you want e.g., ILS, VIS, GPS.
When asked for your approach request, don’t respond with a request to descend via a STAR. That is for center. The approach frequency wants you to state your intent for an ILS, VIS, GPS, FF or RV approach. When they respond continue as filed, expect the XXX approach for XX, that is your permission to continue on your STAR.
Keep it Real™
Nice topic, this will help some pilots not familiarized. Also great comment from @Chitown.
Can I also add:
- When landing, please don’t slow to below 20 - 25 kts on the runway, stay as fast as you can while still being able to make a controlled exit. That really helps us get departures out, and avoid go-arounds. You can still manoeuvre 90 degree exits safely at 12-15 kts, you don’t need to slow to a crawl to do that. When it’s busy tower lines up aircraft straight after you land, and the more time you spend on the runway means the more separation is lost by the aircraft following you down, which leads to lots of go-arounds.
Happy flighting everyone :)
I’d have used “then that’s when violations will be intercepting you”.
Should add that expedite/immediate means:
Get do what you’re doing as quickly as possible:
Exit runway- Please expedite = Get off the runway ASAP,
Get on the runway and takeoff QUCKLY
Doesn’t mean you line up, wait 5 seconds and then takeoff.
Interesting so if center not on I have to still ask app for an ils or rnav then app will check my fpl then say “continue as filled” if I have a STAR?
Yeah very helpful… by the way the pilots that “should make our life easier” don’t have IFC… at least the major part.
But really well said!
Yes, just ask for the approach service you want. Approach can see your FPL and will either let you follow it, or tell you to expect vectors.
Also, keep in mind approach can issue you vectors at anytime. If they do, stop flying your flight plan and follow the vectors.
everytime I always jus ask to decend via STAR and never had a problem never knowing I made the control life worse lol sorry
Nice, will definitely take all these into consideration