Fly.akm’s ATC Tracking Thread - [CLOSED] @ N/A

[fly.akm]

@Zachary_Naponic

Simply clearing an aircraft for takeoff allows them to back taxi if needed.

Just found this whilst studying the manual…

I think I should issue a back-taxi, not a T/O, if so, do I clear it for takeoff after it’s lined up? Or do I send another command asking for a LUAW?

[fly.akm]

@fly.akm

What if they have to cross a runway that doesn’t have a one way exit, as if they cross, but don’t go the same heading to finish the cross, they have to literally taxi to another exit north/south of the runway, do I just issue a crossing?

Also this. 👆

Adding on to it, is it possible that I decline their request and give them progressive taxi instructions?

[USA_ATC]

In this instance it is specific to the situation. Like the manual states “Controllers should be proactive.”

If you use back-taxi I would only use it in the case that there would be a exit and hold short space at the end of the runway. As for not giving clearance to begin with would be more stress and tough on the controller especially in a busy environment. Just think you give a Back Taxi & LUAW and the pilot is isnt cleared for take off and is still in the LUAW waiting for clearance with a plane on Short Final and you scrambling to get to the command. Take off makes so much more sense.

@fly.akm

@fly.akm

What if they have to cross a runway that doesn’t have a one way exit, as if they cross, but don’t go the same heading to finish the cross, they have to literally taxi to another exit north/south of the runway, do I just issue a crossing?

Yes just give cross.

Make sense?

[fly.akm]

@USA_ATC

Make sense?

Yessir, thanks!

[fly.akm]

Currently studying, but I do plan to open sometime tomorrow.

Feel free to vote in the mean time!

What airport should I open at tomorrow?

• KSAN (San Diego)
• EGSS (Stansted)
• KSNA (Santa Ana)
• EGLC (London City)

[Julien_Narayanasawmy]

Nice thread… will probably come along if I am free when you open… so you can add me in your ping list!

[fly.akm]

Added! Hope to see you today when I open! :)

[JulianQ]

add me to that ping list! will hopefully try and make it but i have finals this week so ill do my best :)

[fly.akm]

Update #2

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I have successfully finished thoroughly studying the Tower Manual on the guide. I feel quite confident, it’s a lot to pack in, lots of scenarios and circumstances, but I think I’ve got it down.

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I’ll be opening at KSAN today at 2021-05-23T08:30:00Z, look out for a status update soon.

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Here’s the Study Guide/Notes document I use if you’d like to add any comments or tips & tricks.

[fly.akm]

Open at KSAN

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Airport	Frequencies	Runway/s in Use	Focus Point
KSAN	Ground & Tower	27	Inbounds and mastering Ground

Notams:

• Light aircraft allowed.
• Pattern work allowed
• Alts for patterns are exactly 1,000 for TBs and 1,500 for TJ.

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Open until 2021-05-23T09:25:00Z

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Feedback Format

When giving feedback please I would really appreciate it if you could copy the embedded text below, and give me your ratings & honest feedback!

|**Tower Controlling**|Profeciency Level 1-10|

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|Ground/Tower|Topic of Mistake|Feedback|Profiecency Level 1-10|
|---|---|---|---|

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Ping List:

@Julien_Narayanasawmy
@Airborne_Canuck
@Steven_Tellmann
@Shane
@Darius_Glover
@Collins4486
@nicopizarro
@JulietTango
@HappyDays
@LordWizrak
@Marquatzi
@MJP_27
@JulianQ
@Kedz
@Gritz

[Kedz]

i’ll come in around 15 minutes!

[TheGlobalAviator]

I’m coming!

[fly.akm]

@Kedz

i’ll come in around 15 minutes!

Sounds good!

@TheGlobalAviator

I’m coming!

Ok!

[Gritz]

I’ll be there!

[Antoine_Turrian]

Feedback HB-ANT

Ground

• No issue

Tower

• Very long delay to receive a “hold short” instruction. I requested departure in sequence, what means you can give me “number 2 for departure” as N1DL was also waiting for takeoff.

• Could have told me to LUAW after the aircraft passed the threshold. You can be more efficient with arrival/departure.

• You should have cancelled my takeoff clearance and told G-KEDZ to Go-Around.

If you have any questions, do not hesitate to PM me 😁

[Gritz]

Ground/Tower	Topic of Mistake	Feedback	Profiecency Level 1-10
Tower	Clearance	Should be number 2, not number 3 since Alaska 261 has passed the threshold	Profeciency Level 7

[Kedz]

Feedback-G-KEDZ:

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Inbound/transition:

• Incorrect transition altitude, 2000ft was too low. The pattern altitude at SAN is 1500 using the formula (airport elevation + pattern alt for jet which is 1500 AAL). From this, you need to add 1000ft to the pattern altitude and round it up to the nearest thousand. This would mean transition altitude at SAN is 2500ft AAL.

• Slow response times in general, be speedier to catch conflicts.

• I could of fit before Alaska, best thing was to sequence them behind me but sequencing me behind them was also fine. I would of had fit if you had faster response times.

• Pattern entry and sequence was good.

• No direction with clearance for the option, tell me what direction to make when it touch and go so i know where to fly the pattern. I made right traffic to not confuse you.

• No sequencing on second pattern, you needed to sequence me behind Alaska.

• No clearance for the option, had to announce my position and i still had not recieved any clearance.

• Got very close to HB-ANT. Despite my speed, you should have canceled their takeoff and sent me around. They had to stop themselves. Additionally, i had to call go around because i had not recieved any landing clearance.

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That’s all for me, thanks for having me! I suggest thoroughly going through the ATC manual, good first session.

Introduction | Infinite Flight

[DannyHL]

Feedback, N1DL

Ground

• Only use expect runway XX when you know that you need them to face that direction to avoid any conflicts.

Tower

• I had no idea why you sent me back to the ground frequency, hence the “request frequency change”

• Really slow departure rhythm. Me and HB-ANT had multiple gaps for us to depart in. A good rule of thumb is, if the arrival is under 3 nm away it’s a good idea to wait.

• I didn’t receive any clearance or sequence during my entire pattern as a result I tried to hint it to you that you needed to give me a clearance + sequence with reporting position along the way. A good way to ensure this is to have everyone “green” on your screen before at the latest late downwind. You can already begin to sequence people on their crosswind leg.

• Saudia001VA should have been sequenced behind G-KEDZ after their transition, followed by a sequence to me to follow Saudia.

• In general you missed a lot of Go Arounds, remember it is the controller whom should initiate this, and not the pilot.

Other than that great job 👏🏻

[TheGlobalAviator]

Feedback from Alaska 261

• Ground was good
• Separation is something you have to be aware of. As @DannyHL said, you missed quite a few go arounds, especially during base and final. In the end I had to announce go around due to lost separation, which the controller is the one to give such an instruction, not the pilot.

@DannyHL

In general you missed a lot of Go Arounds, remember it is the controller whom should initiate this, and not the pilot.

• 09:06:36 There were no other planes on the airport or in the air by then. The maintain slowest practical speed was unnecessary.
• 09:06:38 Very late clearance. I was less than 1nm to the runway and the clearance should be issued during downwind or base.
• 09:07:19 Late exit runway command, it was at 50 knots instead of 70.

Overall it was a nice session, there are just things that you have to be aware of!

Oh, and just leave the callsign alone. Nothing special

[fly.akm]

@Antoine_Turrian

You can be more efficient with arrival/departure.

I agree, I messed up a lot on the arrival/departure separation and clearances.

@Antoine_Turrian

You should have cancelled my takeoff clearance and told G-KEDZ to Go-Around.

One of my biggest mistakes, I noticed that.

@Gritz

Should be number 2, not number 3 since Alaska 261 has passed the threshold

Yes, also noticed this, my apologies.

@Kedz

you need to add 1000ft to the pattern altitude and round it up to the nearest thousand.

Wait what? Why?

@Kedz

I could of fit before Alaska , best thing was to sequence them behind me but sequencing me behind them was also fine. I would of had fit if you had faster response times.

Yeah, my separation and sequencing wasn’t the best.

@Kedz

No direction with clearance for the option

Another big mistake by me, I keep forgetting to clear for the option and give landing clearances for full stops.

@Kedz

No clearance for the option

Mhm.

@Kedz

Got very close to HB-ANT . Despite my speed, you should have canceled their takeoff and sent me around.

Ok, I’ll remember that next time.

@Kedz

That’s all for me

Thanks for coming! I’d love to see you come the next time I open! :)

@DannyHL

Only use expect runway XX when you know that you need them to face that direction to avoid any conflicts.

Ok, but I do specify the runway when I give taxi clearance?

@DannyHL

I had no idea why you sent me back to the ground frequency, hence the “request frequency change”

That was a complete fail on my part, I messed up bad and for no reason whatsoever switched you back.

@DannyHL

Really slow departure rhythm.

I have to agree.

@DannyHL

if the arrival is under 3 nm away it’s a good idea to wait.

I read this on the ATC manual, it said when an aircraft is at 600 feet, it’s 3nm away, for some reason though, the altitude doesn’t change on my screen when I show aircraft information.

@DannyHL

In general you missed a lot of Go Arounds

Yep, won’t happen again.

@DannyHL

Other than that great job 👏🏻

Thanks for coming and the feedback!

@TheGlobalAviator

which the controller is the one to give such an instruction, not the pilot.

Taken note of!

@TheGlobalAviator

Very late clearance

Mhm.

@TheGlobalAviator

Late exit runway command, it was at 50 knots instead of 70.

That’s odd, I issued it when you were at 67, maybe I was lagging.

@TheGlobalAviator

Overall it was a nice session

Thank you so much! I’d love to have you come again!