Emergency fuel vs ATC EIDW

Hey IFC,

I was on a flight to EIDW and I planned my fuel on fpltoif.com. 30 min backup fuel. Approaching the airport I was on normal fuel. Then the disaster for me and my crew begun. ATC let us fly turn after turn, which led my fuel capacity to red. I reported 3 times low on fuel and 2 times emergency fuel over a period of 30 mins. This was recognized but no fast track was opened for me. I was forced to stay in line. The last reaction was handing me over to tower while finally set on ILS, and this guy, at least answered again without being able now to help me out in any way. 20 m to airport was now too far away. Sorry for asking: what would a real ATC controller do in such a situation?
The best part of it at all: while turning down, trying to force an emergency landing, ATC was asking for intentions 🤣. Sorry to say but the whole procedure was so unprofessional I even can’t believe this happened on ES. 🤷🏻‍♂️

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Speak to ur IFATC who was on shift, and or speak to Tyler Shelton as he is IFATC manager

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No need for that. Feel free to PM your controller!
Also 30 minutes of fuel is not enough back up. If you saw that pattern at Dublin 30 extra minutes wasn’t going to cut it. Next time bring more fuel! You would rather have to much than to little:)

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Ah ok. Sorry. Had a 1y break off IFC and so bit rusty lol

Honestly I have a rule for me if I have low fuel in ATC area then I’m just going to divert to an uncontrolled airport in the area

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I also dont really think 30 min of extra feul is quite enough I usually pack up to 2 hours of extra depending on weather factors and runway length

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I’ll point out a few things.

  1. Bring more than 30 minutes of extra fuel on any flight and especially to a hub. That isn’t nearly enough to be safe.

  2. It may not have been possible to fast track you in, there are many aircraft in the vicinity. In this case, divert to a different airport when you have emergency fuel.

  3. Contact your controller via IFC and maybe everyone can learn something.

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Nice Idea, I’ll keep that in mind if this’ll ever happen again. But I thought ATC would solve this problem without problem. 4 souls lost (cargo flight)

2 hours is a little excessive, maybe a little more than 1 hr is more reasonable.

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I was controlling Shannon and London Centers just now, so I’ll shed some light on this. EIDW was absolutely jam-packed. You were given turn after turn so you could join the giant S-pattern going south to north, eventually leading into EIDW. That was really the only way we could’ve accommodated the massive amount of traffic today. Fast-tracking anyone today, from what I saw, would’ve caused a domino effect of more issues. Personally, I would’ve suggested you to divert elsewhere instead of trying to land again. The entire S line easily totaled over 100 total miles. In these busy circumstances, just go elsewhere, to be honest. Realistically, you probably would’ve been told to divert if fast tracking wasn’t possible, which was the case today.

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And before using sumbrief for flight planning (including fuel) I would pack the flight time +2 hrs of fuel. So if JFK-LAX is ~6 hr flight I would pack 8 hrs of fuel

IDK, if its a hub you could be stuck for a while, and go arounds, and winds. I just dont really feel comfortable packing less than that unless the flight is very short.

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Ok, but you would agree: there was enough room to separate. Yes maybe I should have packed more fuel for this one. But believe me: there was enough space to solve this. Imo.

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At busy airports (such as the hub), you need to be prepared. Go-arounds, holding patterns, etc., are inevitable, unfortunately. Be ready to take control and do what you need to do. If that means you need to divert, then divert.

That’s true. I’d say if ATC is at your destination airport and/or your flight is a long haul, 2hrs probably is more appropriate. ATC loves their S patterns (and sometimes it’s necessary), so I see what your concern is.

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I don’t have context for this situation, I’ve only looked at EIDW on LiveFlight, and I’m not a radar officer. Just contact your controller and talk :] It unlikely but certainly possible your controller messed up.

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Sure, I am. But I thought this would be treated differently. More like in real life instead of forcing a plane to crash into the ground. (What I did not, I ruined the soil of some fields, but we made it)

Hello, i probably was your controller. Please PM me.

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I will say whoever was tower a few hours ago kept telling me to “say intentions” and check in even after I had 2x. Then ground sent me to tower again and they never answered me.

So I can see how it’s frustrating, but it was very busy and I know that I couldn’t control traffic like that. One more reason I’m not in IFATC.
Just pack more fuel next time, I always have extra. At least 1 hour just because of situations like that.
Everyone is in the same boat and has to make their way through the set approach

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If we could’ve gotten you in quicker, we would’ve. But if you saw what I saw on my radar screen, you’d probably understand why squeezing you in would be quite a challenging thing. Best thing to do is just fly to a nearby airport, and then land there.