Discussing the meta of the forum in public

@Maxmustang is perfect good example of this. informative, interesting and laid back


sorry for tag hey ho

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I can admit i used to be like this until I saw one of Tim_B’s topics. I can guarantee most people do this because they interpret being active like that


in reality being active just means constantly being on the community and having a discussion about something

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I completely agree with you here, @Trio. If you see someone is a basic for example, you can assume they probably don’t know all the main rules of the forum (not trying to stereotype basic users 🙇‍♂️). Then you have a member/regular go and somewhat embarrass the basic user, by telling them what they did wrong, but then they give absolutely no context on what they did wrong besides a thread link. Instead, don’t embarrass the user, and just PM them on the issue.

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So annoying. Crazy part is, one of the worst offenders was quick to comment on this post.

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This has always been an issue here. TL culture and ambition theory have always permeated through the text of users trying to get a leg up. I agree all meta issues should be addressed privately whether that be by flagging or private message. This culture is something I tried to address years ago but sadly didn’t take hold.

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I’ve written a comprehensive post on what it means to be here to build the forum. I am a strong believer that one should join the forum because they want to discuss Infinite Flight and topics that surround it, rather than joining to score brownie points or game the system for a badge that gives you access to the “virtual lounge” (big deal).

Meta issues should most definitely be discussed in private and if it really becomes a problem, leave it to the moderators to let them know that their posts are not up to meta standards rather than those who may not be qualified to do so. Just because you aren’t a regular does not mean that you are somehow deficient in the community, however those who try to be most likely are.

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MaxSez: The answer to the riddle is staring you in the face. Just note that only the professional few are responding here with cogent well founded, observations, opinions and recommendations to improve this now self serving selfy “Blog”. Where are the regular bloviators with there one line responses, inane commentary and criticisms. The Forum is losing its IF/Aviation Enthusiast luster exponentially because of “Them”! Like the “Lounge” what you see here is what you got, just another social form of “me to/first” for the most part. It’s obvious “They” like it this way”!

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That made me laugh.


Everybody is guilty of of this.

I think it’s fine to inform users where the post goes or if it is a duplicate or not, but for example, if it is say, a Concorde Feature Request.

Instead of, “The developers closed the last Concorde request because it was too advanced”

We could say something like that, but add your opinions on the topic, ect…

Then why not PM them instead of enabling 4 or more other users that say the same thing in the comments section? Its pretty obvious people do it to be like “Oh hey mods look at me I’m such a good user, can I please have TL10000 now”. A PM is a much more appropriate method to inform a user, sparring them the embarrassment and spam on their thread, along with being able to help with other questions they have. That’s pretty much the entire point of this thread. If you PM someone, its a much better alternative.

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I am blind

Everyone, including regulars is guilty of doing this at one point or another. This is a great post @Trio. The world of Infinite Flight is much more than announcing “WrOnG CaTEgoRy” or something. But the fact is. We as a community, no matter how many topics we make, will never be perfect, but we can continue to strive to make it better, one topic at a time.


Great topic, well done.

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I 100% agree with you. I was just in contact with someone in PM about how to remove the HUD, and also told him his photo was great. He said about the “Tryhards” is it that bad? I told him it’s a rule in that category but it’s not that bad and people should be more nice about it. It’s so much better to handle it in PM than embarrassing the person in any situation.

Yesss I don’t like it when people comment “should be in #blahblah” instead of actually responding to the topic

I will also give my opinion on this subject now. Even if the comment is long, I would like to ask you to read it completely before commenting on it.

I’m a little divided about this. On the one hand, I fully agree with you that it is not very beneficial for the image of a community to have every comment under a post directly aimed at the fact that the topic is theoretically violating the meta guidelines. On the other hand, it is also important to point out especially to the new Community Members that there are certain rules to follow. Meta is relevant somewhere. We are tens of thousands of people here. If everyone would do what he or she wants, this would be chaos.

You’re right, now you can do this via PM. But then I see the problem in the fact that a user may suddenly receive 7 PMs with one and the same message. For this reason, I can fully understand it if you inform a user in a public comment under the post of the respective user that this does not actually comply with the rules. In this way, other community members will also see that the issue has been addressed and closed. But these other community members would have to stick to it and not mention it over and over again.

However, now comes a very important point:

It is not what you say, it is the way you say it.

Imagine the following situation: A user recently discovered the IFC. He’s still on TL1, so he can’t post in #real-world-aviation. He now finds an article online about a topic that he is enormously enthusiastic about. He decides to share it with us at the IFC. He writes a few lines, shares the article and looks forward to the comments. And the comments are coming. But unfortunately not positive or related to the topic. Nothing but the standard copy/paste “Welcome To The Community” posts.

And right here, I agree with you, this is enormously problematic. One takes the joy and enthusiasm of the user, crumples him with one hand and smashes it by a firm throw against the next wall.

That’s why I’m not a fan of these copy/paste comments. It’s just a race, who’s the fastest in commenting the “Here read this and these links and welcome and blablabla” standard stuff.

I therefore try to deal with the topic first with my comments. I try to understand the people behind the post, because what’s posted is very exciting, even though it might be against the meta rules. I comment the topic first because it is interesting. And then instead of “That’s not allowed, please delete it” I say “For Future post, please notice” or “Have a look at this topic before your next post”. We shouldn’t bash users for something they did, but we should inform them of how they could do it in the future. We can’t change the past, but we can change the future.

I have to admit that I was guilty of some crimes I know criticize myself, both in the past and in more recent times. Like all of us, I’m human. And us humans, we make mistakes. But I try to reflect on my actions and learn from them. So I would like to take back some flags or delete comments, because I simply reacted too hastily. But I’m almost 100% sure that many of us are. Life is a learning process, and here at the IFC we learn more every day.

That’s why I’ve been trying to get to know the IFC a little better for some time now. I comment less, but read a lot more. You can see that when you look at my statistics. I find it interesting to see how the same patterns appear again and again. That’s why I really appreciate this post from you.

In the end, I am firmly convinced that none of us has an evil hidden intention when posting here. Most of us want to help other users. Some just like that, others with the ulterior motive of maybe getting to TL3 faster. This is where it’s important to start. We must create a culture in which criticism can be expressed. But we must shape this culture in such a way that criticism is also expressed constructively, without destroying all joy and enthusiasm.

I wish you all the best and I’m looking forward to see all of you around here! IFC is a great community with many interesting people. We don’t have to like everyone, we don’t have to always agree with each other. But we have to stay respectful.

All the best!
Marc

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One other thing I forgot to mention in my post:

If you think someone needs to see this post, because in their reply it was too “metay” or doesn’t belong in the thread, don’t just reply to them with this thread, as it further more metafies the thread. Just DM it to them, or don’t DM it at all.

Hey, if I’m one of the “offenders” I’m really sorry to everybody. Recently, I’ve been changing and talking about what the post is for. Not about just “Make sure to put it in this category”. I really like this community. And if I’m not one of the offenders, I’m still trying to become a better person everyday. We all make mistakes and it’s how we learn from them. Sorry and thank you.

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Well said, @Trio. This is a reminder for many people here.


Following some topics lately I’ve definitively realized and seen an increase in rude/arrogant behavior. Whether that be replies, or just simply saying an insult in a kind way. One thing that I’m not a fan of is when regulars act as moderators. While people might be regulars, that doesn’t give them the right to just comment whatever they want, how they want. I don’t consider many regulars friends as I once did, because of the reasons I said above. At one point I was going to leave the forum, but then I was reminded that there were many nice people here.


Also if I’m seen as one of the “Offenders” then I apologize. It’s hard to act when your posts get overthrown with insultive and mean comments saying how it doesn’t belong in this community.

Putting the negatives aside, hopefully we as the users can all act up and make this community a better place, with more loving and caring posts that actually contribute to the topic itself.


Clear skies.

please don’t take my post as an insult, but rather as feedback

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@Marc

Your post is brilliant, I hope that everyone reads it in detail! Maybe even read it twice to let it sink in. As a Moderator and former Regular it is difficult sometimes to get through to some users. I treat the forum much like raising my children, being fair but consistent is key. I’ve also learned to take a deep breath and instead of talking down on someone you get on their level and try to put yourself in their shoes. Mods and Staffs aren’t here to ruin or prevent users from having an enjoyable experience. We just ask that some simple rules and guides much like the ones that you would abide by in front of your mother and father or the school principal are followed.

I can say that I’ve made some lifelong friends from this community and many pilots/controllers have expanded my aviation knowledge greatly. IFC is so diverse and extraordinary in many ways unlike other communities. As a whole I think the community has improved immensely from the highest ranking to the new users that join. Is it perfect? No, there is always room for improvement and advancement but that comes with experience and growth.

Levet

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@Levet

This is such a great post mate. It’s just such a shame when people are like this. I feel like we just need to step down and relax. We need to stop being like “Oh mods look at me I’m such a good user I’m correcting categories”. When in reality, this is frowned upon and probably hurting the OP’s feelings. Everyone obviously wants TL3 (including me) but for me, it’s more important to contribute and help to this community rather than just be so worried about what category and other stuff like that. I don’t think you get respect for what trust level you are. I think you would be more respected about how you contribute to this community. For example, @Maxmustang is one of the most respected and knowledgeable users on this forum, but he’s not a regular. Instead of correcting literally every detail, maybe have a conversation in the topic. And just PM the user if it’s in the wrong category instead of embarrassing the user.


I think this community is great and we can fix this problem. This is really a great place to learn and talk about aviation. Have an amazing day everybody.

Cooper

@Levet. MaxSez: Interesting modern approach “Dad”. I’m old school,
“Spare the rod, spoil the child ( in us)”! A bit of Tough-love in moderation from time to time sets the tone. Seems it time to change the tone Firedog, your kiddee’s are getting out of hand. LOL!
Warm Regards, Max

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