Aviation_Capital's ATC Tracking Thread - [CLOSED] @ N/A

It’s what the requirements say for ATC training. :/

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oh, tag me when you are open and i can join and help you:)

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Sounds good! Thanks! ;)

Hey man, I was Air France 389. Overall I think you did great!
But:
-You should have responded a little quicker to my taxi request
-The other aircraft wasn’t close enough for you to say “please expedite” plus he was landing at another runway
-When the Aeroflot a320 asked you for frequency change you should’ve told him “you were already instructed to change frequency”
Honestly I think you did great but keep practicing, good job!

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Thanks for the feedback! ;)

Glad to help!

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Hey,

Firstly, good luck with the continuation of your recruitment to IFATC. My feedback begins below and I’ll be commenting on your handling of me and other aircraft too.

FEEDBACK: BAVA370 @ LFPG - 20TH APRIL 2020

  1. I began at LFPE (a nearby airport) and, after taking off, requested transition through LFPG airspace. You approved my transition at an incorrect and too low an altitude. The airfield elevation at LFPG is around 400ft. However, you approved me for transition at 2,500ft. Remember: virtually always, it is airport elevation (rounded up to the nearest 500ft) + 2,500ft = transition altitude. In this case, it should’ve been 400ft (rounded up to 500ft) + 2,500ft = 3,00ft.
  2. You told Air France 4031 to exit runway 8R after they had landed. There were a few things wrong you did in trying to do this. Firstly, you told them to exit at 84kn (not a controlled speed, you should’ve let the aircraft slow to around 60kn). You told them to expedite their exit. This was wrong and put pressure on the user for no reason. There was no traffic on final for 8R (let alone a 2nm short final) or any aircraft lined up on 8R with traffic on a 3nm short final. You were correct in telling the user to hold short of 8L as Tarom 667 was lined up on that particular runway.
  3. Despite knowing Tarom 667 would be departing your airspace and there being no conflict with them and other aircraft, you kept them on frequency until the requested the change. It should be the Tower controller who does this, but you weren’t proactive (that doesn’t mean send them off as their wheels lift — just don’t let them get 5nm+ away like Tarom 667 did in empty airspace).
  4. I was virtually overhead (1nm out) when I requested a touch and go. However, you told me to “continue inbound.” This was very confusing for me and was the incorrect instruction to give me.
  5. Eventually, you correctly told me to enter “left downwind runway 09R.” You should’ve issued that instruction instead of the earlier “continue inbound.”
  6. For some reason (and, incorrectly so) you told me you’d call my base. Not only this, but you also sent me on a very long downwind phase. The base management instructions should only be used when trying to fit more aircraft into your pattern and to keep it tight or if the aircraft has flown (of the user’s own accord) an unnecessarily long downwind. In which case, you simply should say “turn base” without the prior prompt. In this case, you were wrong to use this command.
  7. You gave me a very delayed clearance for runway 09R. Remember: you can clear aircraft when they’re on the crosswind phase of the pattern unless you’re unsure about sequencing. With only one aircraft in the airspace (more so, for that specific runway) an early clearance would’ve been appropriate and correct.
  8. You incorrectly told N116DB to “continue inbound” when they called “inbound on the ILS” for runway 09R. Granted, they were truly lined up with runway 08R, however, they were on final (6nm out). Correcting their runway alignment instead of forcing them to come closer-and-closer would have been proper.
  9. You didn’t handle my change to runway 08R very well. Without pattern entry, and on the upwind leg, you immediately cleared me for the option at runway 08R. This was not only wrong as you should, at a minimum, clear an aircraft on the crosswind phase — but also, I received no pattern entry.
  10. You cleared both me and N116DB to land and for the option respectively with the sequence position of “number 1.” This is confusing for both aircraft and incorrect in technique.
  11. You tried to half-correct the mistakes made earlier (see point 9). While I was on my downwind leg, you told me to enter the right downwind. This was far too late to be considered a correction. You didn’t fix the sequencing error made before (see point 10).
  12. Once again, you unnecessarily used the base management commands (see point 6).
  13. After my pattern (having been told earlier to make “right traffic”) you effectively repeated yourself by giving me a pattern entry. The “enter right downwind” command was not needed. Remember: only give pattern entry instructions for new entries to a pattern (inbounds) or runway changes.
  14. Once again, you unnecessarily used the base management commands (see point 6).
  15. On my final pattern, you cleared me for the option when I was on short final. This is far too late, I must stress.
  16. You told me to exit the runway, “cross runway 08L, and contact ground” in one command. This would’ve been perfect if you didn’t tell me to do so while I was at almost 90kn. That is not a controlled speed for an aircraft to exit the runway.
  17. Well done for telling me I had already been cleared to cross runway 08L after I requested the runway crossing. Great stuff!
  18. When I informed you that I was “ready to taxi,” you told me to route to parking. This was wrong. Remember: the “ready to taxi” does not mean it is in the controller’s hands to decide — based on context — the user’s intentions. It means you should clear the aircraft to taxi to the nearest active runway. I had to re-request a taxi to a specific runway for my initial request to be fulfilled.
  19. I performed literally all of my taxi to runway 08L on grass. You didn’t instruct me off the grass once; be more vigilant.
  20. When I did request a frequency change (Ground to Tower), you correctly reminded me that I had already been instructed to contact Tower when ready. Well done!
  21. You didn’t notice or act on my extremely major runway incursion. My whole aircraft was over the hold short line of runway 08L. Be more vigilant.
  22. After clearing me for takeoff, you — promptly — got me out of your hands with the [Frequency change approved] command button. Well done.

Overall, you need to work on the theory laid out in the IFATC manual. Referring to tutorial videos, attached below via link, would be very useful too.

I also suggest looking into an IFATC trainer. The information on that has been attached, via link, below.

You must be more proactive, observant, and timely. Not only were a few things you did questionable, but some were also downright wrong — go over those linked resources until you’re comfortable with their content (I didn’t see comfort and confidence in your controlling).

I must, once again, wish you with the very best of luck in the continuation of your IFATC recruitment. I hope to see you controlling on the Expert Server one day.

Thanks,
Patrick

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Open @ EGLL!

Currently open @ RKSI!

i will join!!!

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hello N166AW,


  1. i requested a frequency change when i was already instructed to change
    2)in the beginning there were some very late clearances
  2. When i changed runways i received no new traffic direction
  3. i did not receive a sequence when J-Air was in front of me for rnw 16
  4. i got a double clearance
  5. You missed a go around
  6. Late runway exit

Keep practicing and you will get there

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Thanks for the feedback! For some reason, it is difficult for me to find the correct command sometimes. I have not been able to find the “you were already instructed to change frequency” and I don’t know where it is. But I’ll get there one day!

Open @ KSDF! ;) @CPT_Colorado

Open @ OMDB! ;)

Well, excellent job! Exit / cross command very pro active which was perfect.

Very pro active on giving me the go around command.

Thanks for the clear controlling. :)

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No problem! Thank you for following ATC instructions and being a cooperative pilot! ;) @Marvin_Heijboer

Hey! Thanks for opening, you did really well. There were just a couple things that I wanted to go over:

  • After I read back your instruction to enter right downwind for 12R, you told me to descend to pattern altitude. While it’s great that you recognized the situation, try to give the pilot a chance to execute the command. I had my finger on the AP altitude button and was about to adjust it when you told me to descend. Had I been on downwind or base, that would have been an appropriate time to call it. However, it’ll take some time for me to descend to pattern altitude from your assigned transition altitude, so you’ll need to keep that in mind before telling me to descend.

  • Unless you have a valid reason for wanting someone to exit the runway in a certain direction, try to allow them to go either way. You were very proactive in telling me to exit and cross at the same time, but that would have caused some issues if I’d wanted to exit left.

Other than that, you had a fabulous session. A major takeaway from today is that a little patience goes a long way. Give the pilot time to respond and carry out your instructions, and you’ll find that they’ll be a lot more willing to comply than if you rushed them at every opportunity. Nice work!

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@TaipeiGuru Thanks for the feedback, I really appreciate it! I realized that I did tell you to descent to pattern altitude a little too early, I am trying to find a good fit between being proactive and patient. Also I was curious if the transition altitude I had issued was appropriate.

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62 feet is close enough to sea level that a 2500ft transition altitude would have been acceptable as well. However, there’s nothing wrong with 3000, so you’re fine. :)

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