ATC and server changes

First of all: The topics made by @Chief305, @Skylines, and all other people requesting server changes are entirely different.
Hello IFC,
I am requesting a few changes to ATC on TS and casual.
Casual: ATC are allowed on Casual. No violations, PFI, or other warning messages can be sent.

TS: ATC would be required to take a test to be able to control on TS. ATC can send PFI, check help, and give pilots a violation. There would be a few moderators that ensure quality ATC is being provided, and these moderators would be able to temporarily ban a person from controlling on TS if they don’t know what they are doing, or if they are found to abuse their privileges (issuing a violation, warning messages).
Example requirements for ATC on TS:
Must be 12 years of age or older
Must have at least 300 ops on Casual.
Must be able to pass a 15 question written test.
Must have access to a communication source for the group (Slack, Discord, Discourse, IFC PM, etc)
This environment wouldn’t be as strict as IFATC though.

Expert: The only change to IFATC requirements would be 500 ops on TS only.

Why is this helpful? TS1 is the place where pilots learn the basics of ATC before going on to Expert. But we can’t really have people on TS1 learning ATC if ATC is still learning. This means that there is ATC that sometimes doesn’t know what they’re doing, and pilots can’t learn from that. This defeats the purpose of TS. Having ATC that knows what they’re doing will solve this. The ability to punish pilots on TS will also teach them something.

ATC on TS would also learn a lot from this, meaning they would be more prepared for their written and practical test. This would also bring better quality IFATC to Expert.

This would be a big help to IFATC and pilots on Expert because many of these pilots coming from TS would already know the necessary info. This also helps the pilots because if they have been taught by proper ATC, they are a lot less likely to get ghosted.

TLDR

This would bring better quality pilots and ATC to Expert because pilots can actually learn on TS. ATC can also be more prepared for the tests to get into IFATC.

But these ATC still have to learn, right? That’s why there would be ATC on Casual. For those that say Casual is for learning unicom: pilots can still learn unicom at any airport without ATC, and there will certainly be many of those.
I decided against adding another server because it would be more expensive for FDS, and there would be less people on each server because the load is spread out.

intersting hahaha nice topic :) !
Regard

2 Likes

No way to check this

That’s were expert server is for

1 Like

My vote on this. It’s not only pilot need good guidance, atc also trying to learn. It will be real training server if we can keep trolling pilot and atc out.

1 Like

Who is going to administer the tests? Written or practical or both?

There are already feature requests asking for this to be added back.

Violations cannot be handed out, even on Expert.

No way to validate

This is what the expert server is for.

So what exactly would be the difference between TS and ES be other than the ability to ghost? Its not like the material to study is different for TS than IFATC. Commands are the same, etc. Your idea is basically turning the TS into Expert Lite.

Who maintains the quality of the TS? Who kicks out controllers who haven’t controlled in 6 months? Who handles complaints for TS controllers?

I get it, the TS server could use some work. The devs are aware of this and are thinking are thinking of different ways to improve the quality while still allowing the freedom that the sim provides. There is no perfect solution at this time.

5 Likes

Yeah there are some problems. I’m not proposing a super strict and realistic environment for TS ATC, just ensuring that pilots can actually learn things on TS. That’s really the goal of this. And I agree no way to validate the age, but doesn’t IFATC have an age requirement? Thanks for the feedback though @Chris_S and @Olivier999

Nothing is going to stop a pilot from ignoring commands and landing on top of someone.

I think the issue you are trying to solve for could be better solved by pilot educational resources and not from system limitations.

I just see it as a lot of work to set something up with not a lot of benefit. You have skilled controllers who already know what they are doing on TS. They give the proper commands, they don’t spam, and the pilots may or may not listen. Your system will not change that.

6 Likes

I do never agree with this feature. People are here to learn ATC instructions and you can’t prevent them.

I agree there are really bad trolls but we should focus on trolling. In this way, you are suggesting to prevent all newbies.

Exams, tests are not needed. Training server is a place for learning to work with ATC, you can’t force people to do this. And people don’t have so much time in their life.

Violations are common and automatically applied restrictions and cannot be a toy for ATCs.

I understand, trolls and newbies are disturbing you but we should find another way. If we keep newbies out of TS, they can never learn anything easily and we can’t see many many planes. I agree we need to fight against trollism but we need to help newbies to make them learn to fly.

1 Like

Why? I know a great controller and he’s only 11…

3 Likes

I kinda disagree. This basically makes it easier to be ATC on expert. Anyone can pass a written exam. Anyone. The reason one must contact a recruiter is to ensure that you have a good track record of not being a trouble maker. This new system could cause a pretty hellish environment on expert (cough Hawaiian Spookfest cough)

2 Likes

Thanks everyone for the feedback. I would appreciate if you guys were to not echo what others have already said. A moderator and a few others have already given his feedback; let’s not say the exact same thing.
I would also avoid those responses where you nit pick everything wrong and criticise it.

That’s a lot of ops to have on a server that does not care if you break the rules

300 ops means 300 times of getting frustrated over pilots not listening to you

3 Likes

Why look at it as to do with skills? Internet law changed so much with personal data. 13 is the lowest age it’s in Uk. Rest of Europe 16

I disagree with this idea. The problem is that the changes to casual and Training server would completely ruin their idea in my opinion. Casual is supposed to be the ultimate free server. If you want to goof off, do it on casual, wanna do loops and stunts above jfk? Fine just go to casual. Having atc for this would be kind of pointless and ruin some aspects of the freedom you get when you join casual. Training server is meant to let people who are interested in flying more realistically to basically learn the ropes on ATC and other things. This also includes people who are interested in being IFATC to learn the ropes. This means that the enviorment of training server should be welcoming to most new pilots and they should be allowed to make mistakes that would otherwise not be made on the expert server as they are just learning. This also applies to atc. I feel the basic automatic violations that you get on the training server are enough to get the basic jist of what you need to do. Also having an atc test for training server would significantly reduce the amount of available controllers for that server, in turn not having as many airports open.

In conclusion I think we would be better off with the system that we have currently for casual and training, and if that welcoming enviorment for training will have a couple trolls, so be it, trolls will exist everywhere and are unavoidable.

You’ve obviously put a good amount of thought into this request. Nice.

If I read this correctly your idea is (1) that whatever now applies to TS, goes to CS and (2) to raise the knowledge bar for ATCs on TS and ask moderators to police. Correct?

I support the general idea that controllers on TS (and pilots) could do with more knowledge. It would lower the bar to ES and I believe it would increase the fun on TS.

Any controllers without tested knowledge could control on CS.
I don’t think CS should be a place of “total freedom where you can just goof off”. Doing acrobatic manouvres near uncontrolled airport’s, sure. But as IF tries to be a serious flight sim, the aim of CS should not be a server of anarchy, but a place of learning, without the risk of being punished for mistakes.

The big question (and debate) is more on how you would implement this on TS. What should be the requirement for an ATC to work on TS is a big topic, as is visible in the comments above.

And…while I don’t have the answers on how exactly to implement this, I do think we all would like people to join this forum before they get reported on ES… 😊

2 Likes

I don’t think there would be enough people if to control if they had to take a test